Thursday, August 24, 2023

Quick takes on the GOP Debate

I watched it all. 

Probably none of this matters. 

Judging from the audience reactions, a huge share of GOP voters like Trump and nothing but Trump. That is my big take-away. 

No one so fully distinguished him or her self to become the obvious alternative to Trump. The nomination pits Trump against a pack of aspirants, each with a different agenda, all more-or-less qualified, which sets the frame for the GOP nomination. Trump versus nothing-much. 

Vivek Ramaswamy burst onto the scene. Smiling. Articulate. He was a know-it-all newcomer bully, dripping with hubris and put-downs of the others. He interrupted constantly, grabbed extra time, talked over others. He was Mr. Dominant, Mr. Bully. On policy after policy, he said he was right and everyone else was clueless. And old. And corrupt. They had bad motives, looking for a job on MSNBC. 

Wasn't he being a jerk? Who would introduce himself to a national audience this way? Trump did. Republican voters liked it in 2015 and still do. Trump voters have developed a taste for a contemptuous fighter. The audience last night seemed to like it.

I credit the debate moderators. They inquired about the elephant in the room. They asked candidates if Michael Pence did the right thing on January 6, in refusing to count electoral votes cast for Biden. The question was artful. It didn't ask if Biden won, a question that would have allowed meandering answers about  the GOP primary electorate's lingering doubts about the election. The question was binary: Did Pence do the right thing? With Chris Christie's help, Michael Pence re-positioned the acceptable GOP position on reversing the election result. Pence said it. He was right and Trump was wrong.  

That is huge.

Chris Christie made a straight, sincere statement of support for what Pence did. That  praise for a rival seemed to have broken a spell. The heresy was voiced in front of Republicans, and the earth still spun. Asa Hutchison agreed. So did Haley and Tim Scott. North Dakota Governor Doug Burgum said, "of course." It was safe to come out of hiding. Ramaswamy tried to evade by saying the important thing was the immediate pardon he would give Trump, but buried in his evasion was a yes, Pence was right. 

Ron DeSantis looked at his very worst here. Desantis appears a bit elf-like. Now he looked timid, too, in his effort to evade a clear answer. I already addressed this, he said. The debate hosts pressed him, saying he wasn't answering here and now. Was Pence right? DeSantis pivoted to "weaponization" of law enforcement. The hosts did not let go. Was Pence correct? DeSantis said, "Mike did his duty. I have no beef with him." It wasn't a "yes," but it meant yes. "No beef," will serve. DeSantis had crossed the Rubicon.

Amid the candidate agita and audience noise in this section of the debate, Mike Pence turned out to be last to make a statement on the question about himself. Pence was at his most solemn. He put on a face of Mr. Rectitude, Mr. Christian, Mr. Do-One's-Duty, so help me God. He said he had put his hand on Reagan's Bible, that he swore an oath to the American people and to God, and that what Trump asked him to do was wrong and forbidden by the Constitution. That, too, crossed the Rubicon. He was not saying that what Trump wanted was a good thing to do in concept, were it possible and not technically illegal. That has been the standard GOP formulation, and Pence's way of describing it. He would sound like he regretted he had to do his duty. Not anymore. Pence said that Trump was morally wrong to have demanded it. It was selfish and dishonest.  

All the candidates are on record now defying Trump's claim that Pence should have thrown the election to him. Ernest Hemingway's formulation of bankruptcy -- gradually, then suddenly -- may be at work here. One tiny snowflake finally triggers an unstable snowbank into an avalanche. Eight candidates said Pence was right to deny Trump. Might Lindsay Graham say it? Might Ted Cruz and Mike Lee and Marco Rubio? There is a moral conclusion imbedded in the question of whether Mike Pence was right. If Pence was right, then Trump was not just wrong to have urged Pence do it. It would mean Trump made a request that threatened democracy, and that good Republicans had a responsibility to stop him, not accommodate him. That means the indictments target genuine misbehavior.

I doubt there will be an avalanche. There is a convenient moral escape. Ramaswamy said it, when he said that Trump was the best president of the 21st Century and that he favored an immediate pardon. Trump's errors are irrelevant. Dismiss them. Pardon them. Trump's actions against democracy -- maybe they are crimes, maybe just misunderstandings -- don't matter, not in the face of how wonderful Trump was otherwise. What really matters is that the Department of Justice is making a fuss over things that don't matter. That makes the legal system the bad guy, so move on and investigate something important. Investigate Hunter Biden.




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18 comments:

Ed Cooper said...

Most of what I saw was clips of the food fight posing as debate, but if anybody in the bunch deserves a major bump in popularity, imho, it c would be The Jersey Whale and Mike Pence, both of whom are despised and hated by The Base, for actually pointing out that the twice impeached, 4 times indicted alleged Felon tried to overthrow the Republic on January 6th. Should either of those two gain more than one or two points in the Polls, I will be astonished.

Anonymous said...

You may be right that all of them implicitly agreed that if Pence was right, then Trump was wrong. How do leaders of a good moral character escape from a binary dilemma of values? Ramaswamy: it doesn’t matter because a President can do whatever the f*** they want to. Wecolme to center stage amoral Trump II.

Anonymous said...

The reality is that a lot can happen between now and the primaries and the general election. Every supporter of the former Occupant should have an alternate choice (or two), just in case.

Life happens. The former Occupant has many legal problems and anyone can have a major health or family crisis. I suspect that the other candidates are counting on the front runner falling by the wayside one way or another.

Mc said...

I'm not voting for any republican for the rest of my life.
I didn't watch the debate and didn't read this blog post. Why bother?

Mc said...

(By my "why bother" comment I was referring to watching the debate. I could from the headline that tell the blog post was about the debate so I skipped to the comments. I always appreciate well-thought comments from rational readers.)

Mike Steely said...

Trump still has a 41% lead over his nearest rival in the GOP, which raises the question: Why are Republicans so drawn to him? He’s a greedy, power-mad pathological liar with delusions of adequacy who tried to subvert our democratic process. What sort of people remain so crazy about such a repulsive monstrosity who has 91 felony counts against him? Crazy people.

Michael Trigoboff said...

Here’s what the candidates looked like to me, with the sound turned off:

Pence: presidential, massive, dignified

Haley: indignant, occasionally happy

Scott: positive, happy, uncertain

DeSantis: dour, grumpy, zero charisma

Ramaswamy: noisy little yapping dog, fake teeth-whitened grin, made me want to take him right back to the pound

Burgum: nice guy, but no projection

Christie: accidentally wandered in off the set of the Sopranos

Hutchinson: nothing there

JENNIFER said...

I watched only bits and pieces but was very surprised afterwards when a focus group on CNN voted by a lot that Ramaswamy won the debate, followed by DeSantis and Haley. Most others got zero votes. I thought Ramaswamy was obnoxious, arrogant and ignorant, a bad combination. What you say about his appeal to the base is probably correct. They're not willing to go back to a polite, well-informed candidate, so having a brash personality is everything.

Naturally, being a Democrat, I found Nikki Haley the most palatable. She was actually willing to criticize Trump's $7 trillion in deficit spending instead of just pointing fingers at Democrats.

DeSantis just seems like his answer for everything is to fire someone, kill someone or enact rules to prevent something. He's an obvious bully with zero personal appeal. I will be surprised if he maintains second place status.

Christie isn't afraid of Trump, which is refreshing, but he also comes across as a bully and someone who is tough for toughness sake.

Pence was strangely authentic, something I never would have said while he was VP.

Scott is an empty suit. When he said the first thing he would do was fire Merrick Garland I was like, duh, you won't have to you idiot. He'll be gone either when you get there or as soon as you appoint his replacement. Just a dumb thing to say. He seems like a walking talking point.

Those are my impressions from limited viewing.

Herbert Rothschild said...

This is a good piece, Peter. Thank you for congratulating the Fox quizzers. I also thought they did an excellent job. And I think you rightly focused the largest part of your commentary on the question they posed about whether Pence was right. It was the high point of the evening. The first consequence I'll be looking for is Trump's response.

Malcolm said...

ROFLMAO! Did you ever turn the sound up? Figure out who you’re likely to vote for yet? The mafia-looking guy, maybe? Not many choices for someone who abhors trump as much as you do.

Michael Trigoboff said...

I could vote for any of them but Ramaswamy, depending on how the campaign goes. It’s very early days…

Ed Cooper said...

imho, Pence like a well dressed clothing mannequin, just like he looked standing behind the Firmer Guy for the l4 years Former Guy was staining the carpets in the Oval Office.

Mike said...

Ramaswamy - interesting choice: the 9/11 and Jan. 6 conspiracy theorist. He'll go far.

Anonymous said...

What some people cannot relate to because of their own short-comings is that former Governor Asa Hutchinson is a Southern gentleman. If I was a Republican, I would strongly consider voting for him. He is the anti-Occupant.

But folks on the rude, crude and socially deviant end of the spectrum have no understanding or appreciation of someone like Asa Hutchinson.

Anonymous said...

Asa Hutchinson also has had a very distinguished career. Read his Wikipedia page if not familiar.

It is pathetic when angry losers take cheap pot shots at accomplished and well-mannered individuals. It says so much more about the person hurling the insult.

Michael Trigoboff said...

All I was saying was what Asa Hutchinson looked like to me with the sound turned off. I like the guy, and do not mean to denigrate his character or achievements in any way. But he does not come across well on TV, especially with the sound off.

Mike said...

Of course, with the sound off there would be "nothing there." Most people consider what they have to say relevant.

Ed Cooper said...

I hope he goes far; Moscow, or Pyong Yang would work, or McMurdo.